Anti-roll bars

[Moffet]

I've just been wondering why uprated anti-roll bars have different stiffnesses in relation to the standard.

 

For example, the TRD yellow anti roll bars Tony fitted for me are 100% stiffer at the front but only 50% stiffer at the rear (I think - I'm sure someone can correct me if I'm wrong!). Why aren't they both 100% stiffer or 50% stiffer?

[Mark H.]

If a rear one was too stiff would it make the back end break away easier?

[Tony]

The use of anti-roll bars allows the weight transfer of the front and rear wheels to be adjusted separately, compensating for unequal front/rear weight balance and "tuning" the vehicle's handling characteristics. The stiffness % you display is a recognized standard, additional stiffness would depend on the cars intended use simply by adding adjustable drop-links.

[Sam@TDi]

The stiffness of the bar is directly connected to the vertical load applied to the tire during a steady straight turn, with 100% extra stiffness on the front axle and 50% extra on the rear it's pretty clear that TRD are trying to make the front tires saturate (or reach their grip limit) before the rear and so giving rise to an under steer or push departure.

 

It's probably been done to counter act a natural oversteer characteristic in the chassis and to give the driver more confidence by being able to find the grip limit on the front axle with plenty of rear axle grip left in hand

[Moffet]

Thanks for that. Well explained, Sam, so even I understood it!

[Tony]

Thanks for that. Well explained, Sam, so even I understood it!

I am struggling to understand the % since the car is also lowered this lowers the centre of gravity aggravating the under/over-steer assumption...... Tiss that missing maths in chassis dynamics again.... Principles bother me without actual mathematical evidence to the summery Methinks a Pro-Drive education will clear the fog

[boo50]

so TRD bars are lowering oversteer,

i'm building my is200 for drifting now and it's better to have NO oversteer or udersteer, neutral steering is optimal.

which sway bars are better to get neutral steering, also Hotchkis have the most thick and agressive anti-roll bars set for our cars, also it's adjustable in two positions.

 

 

Hotchkis:

Front 1 1/4" (32mm) Hollow

2 Position Adjustable +56%, +61%

Rear 3/4" (19mm)Chromoly Hollow

2 Position Adjustable +144%, +227%

 

TRD:

Front Stabilizer Bar ø28.6 Hollow

Rear Stabilizer Bar ø16 Solid

 

 

Moffet - i can't find characteristics of TRD bars, but compare to hotchkis set, you must have 100% stiffer at the REAR and 50% stiffer at the FRONT.

 

also - suspension adjustment can too give under- or oversteering.

does anyone here use KW Variant 3 and give some hints me here?

[Mat]

im running TRD yellows which are perfectly fine, i have also a very thick solid Cusco prodrift rear anti roll bar, but i havnt tried it on this car, it used to be fitted on the original blue drift lex, when i ran NO anti roll bar on the front

[TDIPLC]

If any one is interested, we have one remaining set of Eibach (TTE) anti roll bars for the is200 for sale.

 

I believe these are discontinued now so are probably quite rare.

[Mat]

If any one is interested, we have one remaining set of Eibach (TTE) anti roll bars for the is200 for sale.

 

I believe these are discontinued now so are probably quite rare.

 

and adjustable (3 settings) for the rear Bar.

 

i have used these before, and was pleased by them

[boo50]

im running TRD yellows which are perfectly fine, i have also a very thick solid Cusco prodrift rear anti roll bar, but i havnt tried it on this car, it used to be fitted on the original blue drift lex, when i ran NO anti roll bar on the front

 

as i know - Cusco have only one type of anti-roll bars for Altezza/Lexus:

cusco. Anti-Sway

they are ?

 

ALTEZZA SXE10

FRONT

ø30__175 311 A30__140%

Including Sutabilizer bushes and brackets

REAR

ø16__195 311 B__125%

For standard Sutabilizer bushes

 

 

and what settings have TTE bars?

[Mat]

the Cusco prodrift bar is no longer available, and as far as i know, wasnt available for very long...believe me it exists, it cant be fitted to a std subframe

[jammy]

when i ran NO anti roll bar on the front

 

was there any benifit of no arb on the front then ?? ive driven a xr2i with out 1 and that was scary to say the least surlly the front would just wollow about

[Mat]

in relation to drifting it helped alot with the original car, as it helped induce oversteer

[jammy]

gotcha

[boo50]

need recomendation of anto-roll bars for drifting purpose.

what better for lexus ?

 

Cusco

FRONT

ø30__175 311 A30__140%

REAR

ø16__195 311 B__125%

 

or

Hotchkis:

Front 1 1/4" (32mm) Hollow

2 Position Adjustable +56%, +61%

Rear 3/4" (19mm)Chromoly Hollow

2 Position Adjustable +144%, +227%

 

Hotchkis have a very hard rear, cusco have an equal characteristics for front and rear.

so what is better for drifting ?

[Tony]

need recomendation of anto-roll bars for drifting purpose.

what better for lexus ?

 

Cusco

FRONT

ø30__175 311 A30__140%

REAR

ø16__195 311 B__125%

 

or

Hotchkis:

Front 1 1/4" (32mm) Hollow

2 Position Adjustable +56%, +61%

Rear 3/4" (19mm)Chromoly Hollow

2 Position Adjustable +144%, +227%

 

Hotchkis have a very hard rear, cusco have an equal characteristics for front and rear.

so what is better for drifting ?

 

I'll pm Mat for you... If anyone knows about the correct ARB's mat will.

[Mat]

ARB choice is really that, what works for one driver, may not for another, as ive said previously, i run TRD yellows, the only change i may make to this is running with the Cusco prodrift rear bar at some point.

 

ive used TTE, TRD and cusco on the previous car and ended up choosing the TRD yellow with the white car.

 

however if i was to choose between the 2 you have the option off i would go with the Hotchkis as they have some element of adjustability

 

for drifting ideally you want a soft bar on the front, and a hard bar on the rear, its feesable to run a std bar on the front, and uprated on the rear(something worth experimenting with) but this really all depends on many other suspension settings, and the available power at your right foot

[djwozza]

Slightly

 

I have a set of the Red TTE ARB's fitted to my car, with the 3 position rear arb set to the stiffest seting.

They are the best mod I have done to my car bar none, that includes the I.C.E and even the Supercharger

[Mat]

ARB IS the best mod you ca do, i also strongly recomend the chassis braces, if you push the car a fair bit on track.

 

obviously the Japsai braces i made a few years back, although Industrial in there manufacture, were by far the stiffest braces on the market

[boo50]

however if i was to choose between the 2

no, i'm just suppose what this two is more interesting.

if you can recommend anything esle, i'm ready to listen.

 

 

also strongly recomend the chassis braces

i've already install them, custom made, and i can say what they are really works!

they are too very stiffer.

[Tony]

Looks very good.... did you make them yourself.

[Mat]

hollow bar would have been better, and if it was oval, it has more strength, and not as heavy

 

hears the ones i made

 

 

 

 

[boo50]

Looks very good.... did you make them yourself.

 

yes, we produce them now in little production run for our Russian altezza-club.

and it's only a little part of our work

 

hears the ones i made

your bars looks good, my pictures of a bar not painted yet.

also you use square profile, we deside to use trumpet profile, it's more lightweight with the same stifness effect.

and your bar is too low as i see, also if you have a lowered car - how are you driving on a roads ?

maybe your car is only for track use, but how others who install them ?

 

hollow bar would have been better, and if it was oval, it has more strength, and not as heavy

tube have more torsional stiffness, so i think what stab bar must be made from tube, as they always are/

[Mat]

Looks very good.... did you make them yourself.

 

yes, we produce them now in little production run for our Russian altezza-club.

and it's only a little part of our work

 

hears the ones i made

your bars looks good, my pictures of a bar not painted yet.

also you use square profile, we deside to use trumpet profile, it's more lightweight with the same stifness effect.

and your bar is too low as i see, also if you have a lowered car - how are you driving on a roads ?

maybe your car is only for track use, but how others who install them ?

 

hollow bar would have been better, and if it was oval, it has more strength, and not as heavy

tube have more torsional stiffness, so i think what stab bar must be made from tube, as they always are/

the bars are no lower than the TRD bars, the car these are fitted to was very low, i designed a second bar that gave 20mm more clearence

 

but there are around 8 sets of these braces out there, in the UK, and peeps seems happy with them on there road cars

 

i thought yours was solid bar, hollow bar/tube...same thing, but if they work, excellent, thats the most important thing

 

regards weight the bars are made from Alusteel,and Hollow, they are also tube in construction, Alusteel is actually light for the material qty used in comparison to mild steel/carbon steel