scorps Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Yes...the meeting date came and went without a word from the topic starter (im24601) and looks like its fizzled out to nothing. I could be wrong though!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 Any update on this? Nothing really.... His solicitor advised he kept quite online and that's the last i heard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazz33 Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 I believe a few of us where waiting to go to Lexus GB HQ in surry but heard nothing about meeting up?...some update news would be good.(good or bad ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazz33 Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 My car didnt suffer that much due to being on LOC and meeting the nice Mr T @ WIM... but my previous Lexus IS200 did suffer quite bad inner tyre wear but i was not aware of the problem because i was not a member on LOC...but thankfully i do now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil NZ Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 I to have the dreaded Lexus f/tyre wear I have had the car in for an alignment but now with these settings Front- Caster left 5 41' right 5 50' Camber left -0 24' right-0 30' Toe left 0 00' right 0 00' Total 0 00' Rear--Camber left -0 30' right -0 42' Toe left 0.1 right o.5 total 0.15 Thrust angle 0 02' Secondary Angles - SAI left 9 40' right 9 27' Included Angle left 9 16' right 8 57' Setback front -1mm rear 2mm Track Width Diff 19mm Wheel Base Diff -3mm I have a self centering problem,the car wants to keep going in circles.Everyone that I have spoken to here just shrugs there shoulders. The guys that did my alignment have told me this is as good as it gets Any help would be appreciated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 I to have the dreaded Lexus f/tyre wearI have had the car in for an alignment but now with these settings Front- Caster left 5 41' right 5 50' Camber left -0 24' right-0 30' Toe left 0 00' right 0 00' Total 0 00' Rear--Camber left -0 30' right -0 42' Toe left 0.1 right o.5 total 0.15 Thrust angle 0 02' Secondary Angles - SAI left 9 40' right 9 27' Included Angle left 9 16' right 8 57' Setback front -1mm rear 2mm Track Width Diff 19mm Wheel Base Diff -3mm I have a self centering problem,the car wants to keep going in circles.Everyone that I have spoken to here just shrugs there shoulders. The guys that did my alignment have told me this is as good as it gets Any help would be appreciated I assume your car is a 99 model?...... The front cambers are near to OEM but wrong with those castor positions, you need the front cambers set to -10/15'. The self centering problem is this on both locks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 I have a self centering problem,the car wants to keep going in circles.Everyone that I have spoken to here just shrugs there shoulders. The guys that did my alignment have told me this is as good as it gets Any help would be appreciated does the car want to go in circles when your free wheeling or just when you're on the power? were your diff mounts checked? all bushings given the all clear? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil NZ Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Tony-Sorry Tony 2003 should have added that. Yes both locks. Specs Iv got say -51'/-09' on camber I will get it changed to -10'/-15' being a 2003 does that make a difference. I was told the camber and caster cant be changed independently but they gave me back a less than enjoyable car to drive. Noel-Turn the wheel left right fast slow accelerating decelerating doesn't matter wont self center wants to keep on turning.Diff mounts? Lexus = rwd. Suspensions mint shes only done 45000ks/28000mls but I did have a mechanic look it over and he said it was in excellent condition. Had the alignment done after chewing out the inner shoulders of the fronts Cant seem to post pics here but have posted them on http://www.lexusownersclub.co.uk/forum/ind...48284&st=80 . LEXUS MADE AN OFFER AND CHRIS TOOK THE MONEY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Tony-Sorry Tony 2003 should have added that. Yes both locks. Specs Iv got say -51'/-09' on camber I will get it changed to -10'/-15' being a 2003 does that make a difference.I was told the camber and caster cant be changed independently but they gave me back a less than enjoyable car to drive. Noel-Turn the wheel left right fast slow accelerating decelerating doesn't matter wont self center wants to keep on turning.Diff mounts? Lexus = rwd. Suspensions mint shes only done 45000ks/28000mls but I did have a mechanic look it over and he said it was in excellent condition. Had the alignment done after chewing out the inner shoulders of the fronts Cant seem to post pics here but have posted them on http://www.lexusownersclub.co.uk/forum/ind...48284&st=80 . LEXUS MADE AN OFFER AND CHRIS TOOK THE MONEY On the 99 0n Lex the rear camber should be -55'..... Often a bent steering arm will hold the lock on one wheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djwozza Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 LEXUS MADE AN OFFER AND CHRIS TOOK THE MONEY Hmmm tell me more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Diff mounts? Lexus = rwd. Thanks for the information... and what do you think drives the rear wheels? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 @ 28K no way would the diff mounts have issues, anyway if they were at fault "you would know it". It could be said the power steering fluid or transfer valves are the criminal but i would expect complaints about heavy/soft steering feel or the pump screaming.... Neither would be expected with your mileage. Geometrically there is one angle that supports your complaint "TOOT" or Toe-Out-On-Turns. TOOT acts in one situation and as an individual on a particular lock left / right. It's job is to ensure the inner wheel has more lock than the outer wheel during a turn... Here's an image> The acceleration of TOOT is accentuated by the degree of lock so the more lock the more lock-gain the inner wheel has compared to the outer wheel. So since the TOOT is activated independently on each lock then damage to a steering arm or track rod end will amplify that wheels TOOT. Steering return is dependent on the perpendicular position of the King Pin and the castor angle sweep but there is a limit to their forces acting to aid return. A TOOT gain on the inner wheel as little as 30' (over design) will belay steerings natural ability to return so the driver will need to assist. The machine that measured your calibration looks like it's also able to measure the TOOT, ask them to measure this as well as the "total lock angle" left/right...... And we can go from there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hms Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Tony, how is this related to Ackerman, as to my eyes they are the same thing? Both offer a difference in the steering radius across the axle. h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Tony,how is this related to Ackerman, as to my eyes they are the same thing? Both offer a difference in the steering radius across the axle. h Yep same thing.... Problem is over the years terminology has changed so i offer the latest versions (old was best) Ackerman is now Toe Out On Turns KPI was King Pin Inclination... Now SAI= Steering Axis Inclination or SJI, Steering Joint Inclination..... what a load of pants Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil NZ Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Thanks Tony Will book it in for toot and total lock angle .They also have on there report the Included angle, Toe curve change and Total thrust angle but these haven't been measured I'll get these done as well.Is total lock angle the same as Total thrust angle or included angle. LEXUS MADE AN OFFER AND CHRIS TOOK THE MONEY Hmmm tell me more Just a guess I hope he didn't disappear just be for his big meeting with Lexus under suspicious circumstances. Noel-- I will try that again Diff mounts?(why would diff mounts be a steering problem)Lexus=rwd (how does the rear affect self centering ?) genuine question no sarcasm intended. And the motor drives the rear wheels through the drive train (maybe a little sarcasm there) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 It's typical the other angles were not measured.... Included angle i'm not concerned with, "Toe curve change" may also mean TOOT so that is a must as is the total lock angles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil NZ Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 It's typical the other angles were not measured.... Included angle i'm not concerned with, "Toe curve change" may also mean TOOT so that is a must as is the total lock angles. Booked in for tomorrow Thanks again for your time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 It's typical the other angles were not measured.... Included angle i'm not concerned with, "Toe curve change" may also mean TOOT so that is a must as is the total lock angles. Booked in for tomorrow Thanks again for your time Settings now displayed in LOC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hms Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Tony,how is this related to Ackerman, as to my eyes they are the same thing? Both offer a difference in the steering radius across the axle. h Yep same thing.... Problem is over the years terminology has changed so i offer the latest versions (old was best) Ackerman is now Toe Out On Turns KPI was King Pin Inclination... Now SAI= Steering Axis Inclination or SJI, Steering Joint Inclination..... what a load of pants Cheers Tony. Must read more up to date books! h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 8, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 Tony,how is this related to Ackerman, as to my eyes they are the same thing? Both offer a difference in the steering radius across the axle. h Yep same thing.... Problem is over the years terminology has changed so i offer the latest versions (old was best) Ackerman is now Toe Out On Turns KPI was King Pin Inclination... Now SAI= Steering Axis Inclination or SJI, Steering Joint Inclination..... what a load of pants Cheers Tony. Must read more up to date books! h It's all the same thing just different terminology Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil NZ Posted May 10, 2008 Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 Tony This is What I got when I asked for a change to the Camber (first list).This machine looks like its out as the camber numbers are the same but the caster is different.And as the next geometry report shows they started off different on there machine. Took car to another company with a machine that could measure TOOT(Second list) AND EVEN AFTER I TOLD THEM NOT TO THEY CHANGED THE CAMBER OK thats enough yelling.I didn't pay them and I have been told to bring it back. Whats up with measuring Toe in mm not degrees ??? Does the TOOT look right to you??? I have noticed that the steering self centers when driving over 60kmh But still doesn't self center under 60kmh Thanks Customer: Date: 5/9/08 Company: VIN License NO: EBM708 Technician: Ie Odometer: Order NO: VEHICLE ALIGNMENT REPORT LEXUS, 2003, IS 200 GXEI0 Primary Angles _____ Initial _____ Specifications _____ Final Caster Left _____ 5°52' _____ 5°16' 6°16' _____ 5°41' Right ______ 5°36' _____ 5°16' 6°16' _____ 6°35' Camber Left - _____ 0°12' _____ -0°51'- 0°09' _____ -0°12' Right , _____ -0°30' _____ -0°51' 0°09' _____ -0°12' Toe Left _____ 0.05° , _____ -0.05° 0.15° _____ 0.00° Right _____ 0.15° _____ -0.05° 0.15 _____ 0.00° Total _____ 0.20° _____ -0.10° 0.30° _____ 0.00° Rear Camber Left _____ -0°36' _____ -0°53' 0°07' _____ -0°36' Right ______ -0°36' ______ -0°53' 0°07' _____ -0°36' Toe Left ______ -0.05°_____ 0.00° 0.20° _____ 0.05° Right ______ 0.10° _____ 0.00° 0.20° _____ 0.10° Total _____ 0.05° _____ 0.00° 0.40° _____ 0.15° Thrust Angle _____ -0°04' _____________________________ -0°01' Customer: EBM 708 Date: 9/05/2008 3:20 p.m. . VEHICLE ALIGNMENT REPORT LEXUS, IS 200,01-05, GXE10 JCE10 2.0L 3.0L from 0038998 Primary Angles ~~Initial ~~~~Specifications ~~~~Final Caster ~Left ~~ 5.97 ~~ 5.27 6.27° ~~ 5.81° Right ~~6.33° ~~5.27 6.2r7~~ 6.24° Camber ~Left ~~ -0.17 ~~ -0.85° 0.15° ~~ -0.32° Front ~Right ~~-0.42° ~~ -0.85° 0.15° ~~ -0.54° Toe ~Left ~~ 0.4mm ~~ -0.3mm 0.9mm ~~ 0.2mm ~Right ~~-0.1mm ~~ -0.3mm 0.9mm ~~0.3mm ~Total ~~0.4mm~~ -0.6mm 1.9mm ~~0.5mm Camber Left ~-0.84° ~~-0.85° 0.15° ~~ -0.75° ~Right ~~-0.75° -0.85° 0.15° ~~ -0.65° Rear Toe ~Left ~~1.1mm ~~O.Omm 1.2mm ~~0.6mm ~Right ~~0.6mm ~~O.Omm 1.2mm ~~0.7mm ~Total ~~1.6mm' ~~ O.Omm 2.5mm ~~ 1.4mm Thrust Angle ~ 0.04° ~~~~ - ~~~~ -0.01° Secondary Angles ~Initial ~~ Specifications ~~ Final SAI ~Left ~~8.98° ~~8.77 9.77 ~~9.13° ~Right ~~ 9.18° ~~ 8.77 9.77° ~~9.31° Included Angle ~Left ~8.81° - ~~~~~ - 8.81° ~Right ~~ 8.76° -~~~~~ - 8.77 Toe Out On Turns ~Left ~~1.75° -~~~~~ - 1.71° ~Right ~ ~1.60° - ~~~~~ - 1.48° Max Turn Inside ~Left ~ `35.06° ~~33.51° 33.51° ~~ 27.56° ~Right ~~ 33.91° 33.51° 33.51° 28.92° Toe Curve Change ~Left ~~- ~~- - ~~- ~Right ~~- ~~ - - ~~ - Setback ~Front ~~ -1mm ~~- -- ~~-1mm ~Rear ~~ Omm ~~- -- ~~ Omm Track Width Diff. ~~14mm ~~~~~ 14mm Wheel Base Diff. ~~-1mm ~~~~~ -1mm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 10, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2008 Just to complicate things the reports are in different measurements "degrees and minutes and decimal degrees and minutes". Either way and obvious inconsistency is the low NSF castor. This will belay steering return "left"... Is left you main problem? Another issue is the IS has variable power steering assistance that's accentuated by speed... Before we go there how is the steering return right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil NZ Posted May 11, 2008 Report Share Posted May 11, 2008 Just to complicate things the reports are in different measurements "degrees and minutes and decimal degrees and minutes". Either way and obvious inconsistency is the low NSF castor. This will belay steering return "left"... Is left you main problem? Another issue is the IS has variable power steering assistance that's accentuated by speed... Before we go there how is the steering return right? NSF ? Both sides same ,left maybe a little worse. Gets better the faster you go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2008 First report shows NSF@ 5.41 OSF@ 6.35 OEM max is 6.16... Geometrically the disparity is a mile out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil NZ Posted May 11, 2008 Report Share Posted May 11, 2008 Car went on the second machine straight after the first, with a short drive between. The Geometrically disparity may have been caused by the machine giving incorrect readings . First report the final setting the camber is set equal but the NSF/OSF are not.The second report done soon after shows at initial, camber uneven as well as caster. Is this correct -- The first report degrees broken into minutes and the second degrees broken into tenths. So to calculate camber rear at 55 minutes I would divide it by 6 to get tenths 0.916 degrees or camber front -0.12' = -0.166 degrees I'm going to check today how they measure TOOT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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