jackherer Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 I come across off-centre racks all the time, if it's a home build then fair enough it may simply involve setting the racks centre to the thrust via the steering arms or actually moving the racks anchor points to centre it, either way it's nothing difficult. I'm specifically talking about when the rack is off centre via the steering arms because the orientation of the steering wheel has been used as the datum for the centre of the rack. I.E. when someone has put the steering wheel on at random then had a low end tyre place set the toe so both wheels point forward when the steering wheel is straight. So to rephrase my question, how often do you have to remove the steering wheel and replace it so its straight after aligning the chassis? I imagine the fitting of airbags reduces this issue as people are less likely to take their own steering wheels off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackherer Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 would have to be really bad to cause bump steer wouldn't it ? It was quite bad as I really had no idea what I was doing back then... Also its a track spec 205 gti with an LSD, thicker torsion bars and high poundage springs, Gaz gold dampers, thicker ARBs, a multipoint weld in cage etc and little changes can really upset it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 I come across off-centre racks all the time, if it's a home build then fair enough it may simply involve setting the racks centre to the thrust via the steering arms or actually moving the racks anchor points to centre it, either way it's nothing difficult. I'm specifically talking about when the rack is off centre via the steering arms because the orientation of the steering wheel has been used as the datum for the centre of the rack. I.E. when someone has put the steering wheel on at random then had a low end tyre place set the toe so both wheels point forward when the steering wheel is straight. So to rephrase my question, how often do you have to remove the steering wheel and replace it so its straight after aligning the chassis? I imagine the fitting of airbags reduces this issue as people are less likely to take their own steering wheels off. Excluding the single adjuster of the Golf i have never had to remove the steering wheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackherer Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 Excluding the single adjuster of the Golf i have never had to remove the steering wheel. Its lucky I learned a thing or two from your site and fixed it myself rather than bringing it in to you then - would have been a definite for 'Horror Of The Week' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 Excluding the single adjuster of the Golf i have never had to remove the steering wheel. Its lucky I learned a thing or two from your site and fixed it myself rather than bringing it in to you then - would have been a definite for 'Horror Of The Week' Hang about, i don't want to be giving to much away!!.... only kidding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbotrev Posted November 12, 2009 Report Share Posted November 12, 2009 Right i should have my Tein tension rods tomorrow, and also getting ez camber bolts for the rear to fine tune it. Rang Langs again, and he's said that you gave him some figures to try out. However, with the caster now being adjustable, will thoses figures change much if the caster is decreased?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted November 12, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2009 Where did you get the tension rods from? I need to order some ASAP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbotrev Posted November 12, 2009 Report Share Posted November 12, 2009 Camskill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted November 12, 2009 Report Share Posted November 12, 2009 Right i should have my Tein tension rods tomorrow, and also getting ez camber bolts for the rear to fine tune it. Rang Langs again, and he's said that you gave him some figures to try out. However, with the caster now being adjustable, will thoses figures change much if the caster is decreased?? No we want the castor increased between 4.5 and 5 degrees........ plan is this... Rear Camber: -45' Toe: + 20 to 30' total Front Camber: -1 degree 30' Castor: + 4 degrees 30' to 5 degrees Toe: -30' total You wanted oversteer so i warn you now she will turn in like a bitch on a promise so be careful and get a feel of how progressive she is. If she feels twitchy at fast straights then back the front Toe off to zero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted November 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2009 That's gonna be a handful! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted November 13, 2009 Report Share Posted November 13, 2009 Yeah but fun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted November 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2009 Not that I can talk. My castor is so far out I actually get cramp in my hand from driving it I have to hold the wheel so tight to fight the bump steer!! I must order those tension rods! Given how far my castor is out do you know how much adjustment I'll need. The tein ones only have 5mm or so IIRC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted November 13, 2009 Report Share Posted November 13, 2009 Your going to need more than 5mm..... all the one's I've seen give about +- 30mm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted November 14, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2009 Hmmm, perhaps turbo rev can advise how much adjustment he has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbotrev Posted November 14, 2009 Report Share Posted November 14, 2009 I would love to advise, but only got the rods yesterday whilst i was slowly driving around Oulton Park. ;-) . There does seem to be quite a bit of adjustment on the threads though. Will be interesting to find out how much it will move when theyre fitted. At least 30mm adjustment in the thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbotrev Posted November 14, 2009 Report Share Posted November 14, 2009 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted November 14, 2009 Report Share Posted November 14, 2009 Told ya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted November 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Right, I'll have to pick up a set of those as the car is impossible to drive fast at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbotrev Posted November 16, 2009 Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Actually, now ive got mine, and my track day is done- which handled terribly in the wet by the way, I could do with a decent all round fast road set up instead. Just stable but still quick for country lanes and the like. I presume the caster would be reduced now as would the toe?? Cheers. I will go to Langs when i'm next off work to get it set up until my next 'DRY' track day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted November 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Back to my original post, the most important thing is knowing how your car is currently set, and how you want it to be. Me and Tony have tried loads of different setups, I think the best fast road setup was fairly stock, just a little more aggressive on the cambers (not by much). I didn't think toe out works at all for the light fronted SW20. The setups that were fast on track really didn't give me much confidence on the road as I liked my car very tail happy on track. Once you get used to driving the 2 you can still drive tail happy with a normal setup just with technique (trailing brake etc) No turbo mr2 handles that well in the wet, whatever the setup the combination of a big turbo and mid engined makes balancing the car very difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted November 16, 2009 Report Share Posted November 16, 2009 Thing is jon after a couple of years calibrating the race cars i've learnt to move away from the "stock +- tolerance" avenue and use my own home grown settings. If they want oversteer you will have oversteer, the drivers ability is no longer my concern since i serve the command. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Right Tony, one for you. I've got the adjustable tension rods and hope to fit them this weekend. While I will be bringing the car to you as soon as I can I'd like to try and get the castor a bit closer to where it should be while fitting them. The current castor is: Front left: +2o 44' Front Right: +1o 13' Cross: 1o 13' Target: 3o 15' +- 0o 30' SAI: 16o 02' both sides Target: 13o 50' I will be measuring the new rods against the existing ones to make sure I get the length the same, but during this process it would make sense to adjust the front right caster in the correct direction. My question is, which way does it need to be (shorter or longer) and by appox, how much? I'm thinking the wheel needs to move forward a little so potentially 5-10mm adjustment... A nice simple one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Longer by about 10mm methinks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CIH Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 could I ask a question without serious thread hijackage ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 could I ask a question without serious thread hijackage ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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