parthiban Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Had an odd problem with the car last week, drove it home from Stansted on Monday night (so a fairly long, high speed drive) and everything was fine. Didn't use the car again for the rest of the week, got in it on Saturday morning and battery was completely dead. Wouldn't even try to start, just got the usual relay clicking sound. All dash lights came on though, central locking was fine, radio and satnav came on briefly before switching off again. Jump-started the car and it started immediately with no hesitation, and seemed perfectly fine after that. Haven't used it again since the weekend but a bit concerned that it seems the long drive might be what killed the battery. No obvious tell tale signs though, dimming lights, etc so a bit confused as to what drained the battery. Want to test all the voltages, does anyone have a recommendation on a multimeter to buy and also any advice on what I do with it when I get it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Did you not have a problem with your battery draining a while ago, around the same time I had issues with mine? Have a read of my Mondeo blog, somewhere in there someone gave me advise on how to use a multimeter to check the battery and alternater. I take it the battery light isn't coming on when you're driving as that's a sign the system isn't charging. It does sound like the battery is just knackered though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Did you not have a problem with your battery draining a while ago, around the same time I had issues with mine? Can't remember when that was, but think that might have been when the battery was actually dead (last changed the battery in early 2011). Surprised it could be the battery again so soon, but more so because it went from completely fine to completely dead in the space of a few days - that's why I want to have a look at the voltages to see if there might either be something draining when the car's off, or alternatively not charging the battery properly. Weird part is that it went dead after a long, high speed drive, when it should have had a decent opportunity to charge up when compared to my usual shorter, stop start journeys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 If there was a problem with the charging system the battery light should come on. Is the boot light going off? Can you check the water levels in the battery or is it sealed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 If there was a problem with the charging system the battery light should come on. Is the boot light going off? Can you check the water levels in the battery or is it sealed? Checked the boot light and it's off, battery is sealed. Actually now that you've reminded me, the previous battery issue I had was earlier this year wasn't it? Can't remember that one at all, a lack of use is probably a contributory factor but checking the voltages/drains seems wise at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Yes in January you had a problem - http://www.wheels-inmotion.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=8636&st=80&do=findComment&comment=95567 Battery should be around 12.6v I think when off and when idle around 13v. With the system under load so lights on, demister etc it should jump to about 14.4v. If it doesn't change then there is an issue. I just use a cheap multimeter like this - http://www.maplin.co.uk/domestic-multimeter-37279 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Yes in January you had a problem - http://www.wheels-in...t=80#entry95567 Battery should be around 12.6v I think when off and when idle around 13v. With the system under load so lights on, demister etc it should jump to about 14.4v. If it doesn't change then there is an issue. I just use a cheap multimeter like this - http://www.maplin.co...ultimeter-37279 Nice find thanks, completely forgot about that, clearly after charging the battery up it's been fine until now. Cool I'll pick up one of those multimeters over the weekend, all I'm doing is just measuring the voltage across the battery, don't need to measure anything else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted September 5, 2012 Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Yeah that will be fine for measuring the battery, don't need anything fancy. Strange how it's been fine since January then, could be an alternator problem but the light should be on if it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted September 5, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2012 Yeah that will be fine for measuring the battery, don't need anything fancy. Strange how it's been fine since January then, could be an alternator problem but the light should be on if it was. Yep no warning lights and no dimming of headlights so hoping it's not the alternator. I'm guessing it must be some kind of power drain somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GamithUK Posted September 6, 2012 Report Share Posted September 6, 2012 I once had an alternator that had one side of he commutator disconnected/broken - it would put out 14v, but only half the time - so the battery effectively wasn't charging enough. Check for damp on the battery - especially from the positive terminal to ground/ earth, that it's not earthing against the bonnet or something, that the glovebox light doesn't stay on - or any other internal light come to that since a failed door switch or similar could also be the culprit. If you think you will be leaving the car for some time without using it you can also get a solar charger to keep the battery topped up (http://www.maplin.co.uk/search?criteria=solar+charger) though you may need to wire it up directly to the battery since most cigarette sockets (are they still called that?) disconnect after a minute or so. How I test with a multimeter is to take a reading across the terminals with the engine off, then start the engine and take another reading - the first should be 12v and the second around 14v. If the static (engine off) reading is gradually going down (12v, 11.9v, 11,8v etc.) try taking each fuse out in turn and see if the drain stops. Go though all the fuses just in case there is more than one drain. Identifying the circuit that is causing the drain is a good start. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted September 7, 2012 Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Some good advice there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted September 7, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 Yep excellent advice, will try all of that - thanks very much!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted September 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Got myself a multimeter on Saturday and did a few checks. First off having left the car for a week, checked the battery voltage and it was showing 9.8V. Unsurprisingly the car wouldn't start, after a jump though again started instantly without hesitation. With the engine running on idle, the voltage across the battery was showing 13V, revving the engine raised it to no higher than 13.68V - does this seem too low? Doing a similar test on my sis's Mini which hasn't been used in over 3 weeks, standing battery voltage was 12V, and engine idle was bang on 14V, not fluctuating at all regardless of what was on or off, or the engine revs. To check whether the battery is struggling to hold charge I charged it up overnight, took it off yesterday morning and it was showing 12.6V. Left it sitting all day not connected to anything and in the evening it was still showing 12.6V - not sure if that test actually says anything but thought it might test whether the battery is losing charge on its own? Finally last night I popped the battery back in the car but just left it - going to check this evening if the battery voltage has dropped at all without having done anything other than just being replaced in the car, and then I'll start it up and measure the same running voltages I did last time. Do you guys have any comments on any of the numbers above, and any other tests I can carry out? After switching the car off on Saturday it didn't seem the battery voltage was really dropping away so it didn't seem like there was a drain, but this will be better to test now the battery is fully charged up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liner33 Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 If its dropped as low as 9.8v replace it , a low battery will drag down the charging system and put it under additional load Secondly but the Ctek battery charger conditioner that i'm selling ideal if you are leaving the car for long periods Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipercar93 Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 You could look at topping up the fluid in the battery, I had a battery that wouldn't hold a charge, topped the fluid up and it's perfect now. It's not for everyone though. You need de-ionized water and it may not work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted September 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 If its dropped as low as 9.8v replace it , a low battery will drag down the charging system and put it under additional load Secondly but the Ctek battery charger conditioner that i'm selling ideal if you are leaving the car for long periods If it loses charge again I will get it replaced (hopefully under warranty), but at the moment trying to work out whether it's the battery at fault or if there is a drain somewhere or just not charging properly. You could look at topping up the fluid in the battery, I had a battery that wouldn't hold a charge, topped the fluid up and it's perfect now. It's not for everyone though. You need de-ionized water and it may not work. The battery looks sealed, doesn't look like it can be topped up - either way I'll report back with the voltage it's at this evening after it's spent all day sitting in the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GamithUK Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 Replacing the battery doesn't answer the question of whether there is a drain or not, but it's worth a shot. 13.86v seems rather low, but that could be the battery not having enough charge - I do seem to recall a comment somewhere about the alternator needing a certain level of voltage in order to produce a usable output, ie if the battery voltage is low then so will the alternator battery. It may also be worth checking the alternator after getting the battery recharged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipercar93 Posted September 10, 2012 Report Share Posted September 10, 2012 If you have a bad battery it will alter your alternator charge voltage. Is this what you are referring to Gamith? 13.86 is right at the minimum acceptable charge from an alternator really. If the battery is charged it could be the alternator maybe? I know if you have an immobilizer fitted they tend to drain batteries really quick. If I have mine sit for more than a week or two I cannot start my car. I use a solar charger to trickle enough in to keep the batter topped up enough so I can still turn it over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted September 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 Got home quite late yesterday so didn't get a chance to check if the battery had lost any voltage just sitting all day, will check it this evening hopefully. 13.86v seems rather low, but that could be the battery not having enough charge I was actually a bit more concerned that on idle I was only getting 13V - but if the battery voltage being low can be a factor, I'll have to check that again now that the battery is charged. If I have mine sit for more than a week or two I cannot start my car. That shouldn't be right should it? As I mentioned above, as a check I tested the battery on my sis's Mini which had sat without being started for over 3 weeks, battery was bang on 12V, started first time without hesitation, and on idle was reading a steady 14V. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipercar93 Posted September 11, 2012 Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 I have an aftermarket immobolizer, they tend to be a bit power hungry. Cars with OEM immobolizers should last a lot longer. The alternator can read a bit low on idle, depends on how well the alternator is made and what rpm range it's meant to operate in efficiently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GamithUK Posted September 11, 2012 Report Share Posted September 11, 2012 If you have a bad battery it will alter your alternator charge voltage. Is this what you are referring to Gamith? That's what I have heard, yes, and the obvious thing to do its to charge the battery back up to 12v and try again - if the alternator is still giving only 13v then I would say the alternator needs a serious look at since I'm sure that can't be a high enough output to be effective. Have you put the multimeter on the battery with the engine off, and taken several readings? say every 5 mins for half and hour or so? that would give an indication of a drain - especially if you then disconnect the battery and see if it stops. ttfn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted September 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2012 Have you put the multimeter on the battery with the engine off, and taken several readings? say every 5 mins for half and hour or so? that would give an indication of a drain - especially if you then disconnect the battery and see if it stops. Charged it up and put the battery back in the car on Sunday night when it was showing 12.6V. Just checked it now and it is showing 12.27V. Is that enough of a drop to indicate a drain or does that seem fairly normal? Haven't started the car yet, want to leave it for the rest of the week and see how far the battery voltage drops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GamithUK Posted September 12, 2012 Report Share Posted September 12, 2012 >want to leave it for the rest of the week and see how far the battery voltage drops. That sounds like a plan, but expect it to be around 9v in a week. If you try the same with the battery disconnected you will see if the battery is losing the charge by itself or not - if it's still at 12v then you know the battery is Ok (enough). Dropping from 12.6 to 12.27 in a day and a half doesn't sound like much, but it might be good to try it every 24 hours and keep a log: Day Reading (v) Drop (v) Sunday (eve) 12.6 Monday 12.49 0.11 Tuesday 12.38 0.11 Wednesday 12.27 0.11 Thursday 12.16 0.11 Friday 12.05 0.11 Saturday 11.94 0.11 Sunday 11.83 0.11 Monday 11.72 0.11 I just knocked this up from the figures you gave above - if the drop continues at the rate indicated then a weeks drop should equate to only a little under 12v, which doesn't sound too bad, but it could be that the drop accelerates with time, that my reading time estimates are wrong or maybe some other factor is at play - for instance maybe the glovebox light isn't on now :-) ttfn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liner33 Posted September 13, 2012 Report Share Posted September 13, 2012 12.27 is significantly undercharged , do you know how to check for a drain?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted September 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2012 It was 12.6V when I took it off the charger on Sunday morning, and having left it disconnected all day (roughly 12 hours) it was still 12.6V at the end of the day. Was that not long enough to check if the battery is losing charge on its own? If so I'll charge it up again and leave it off the car for longer. Yep plan to take a few regular readings, I'll take another one tonight and see how things are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.