jedi Posted May 25, 2014 Report Share Posted May 25, 2014 Hi all, Just looking for some advice on a Freelander I have just had 4 wheel aligned...2001 model TD4 The origional fault was that the steering track rod ends had worn and so were changed by myself for MOT purposes, before this the car tended to wander left/right on the road, (Not suprising really considering how much play there was in the track rod ends) also the steering wheel was off center to the right. After the track rod ends were changed, I could not feel much difference, apart the clunking noises from the warn ball joints had gone... car still wanders on the road left/right, steering still of center to the right. So off I went to get it all aligned Now the car has a pull towards the left, and the steering wheel wants to naturally sit towards the left of center position......If I hold the wheel straight the car will go in a straight line......but if I let go of the steering wheel, it wants to naturally park its seft left of center and then pulls that way.......This pull to the left was not that noticable before the alignment, as it pulled both ways.... any ideas Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 25, 2014 Report Share Posted May 25, 2014 Hi ya....... Can you do a little test for me? In a safe place at around 5/ 10mph let go of the steering wheel and watch to see if it steps incrementally to the left? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedi Posted May 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 25, 2014 I dont think it increments to the left, more of a smooth fluid turn....However what I noticed when reversing was that the wheel turned to the right? So going forward turns to left when reversing goes to the right....or is it just me??? http://www.4shared.com/video/BgBbB1Toba/20140525_103332.html Link to video of what the wheel does moving forward. The car seems very sensitive to road variations... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 25, 2014 Report Share Posted May 25, 2014 Vid won't load but by the sounds of things i think the problem is the tyres..... Have the front wheels with tyres moved side-to-side, they won't need balancing or anything like that then test drive again. If the problem changes direction then we have found the criminal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedi Posted May 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 25, 2014 Ok thanks Tony, if it ever stops raining I will swap then around and report back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 25, 2014 Report Share Posted May 25, 2014 If the pull stops or goes the other way it doesn't mean you need new tyres or that they are defective. It's more of a build issue and often happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedi Posted May 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 25, 2014 A build issue in what way exactly? Is one bigger than the other, heavier? And is it only the fronts I should try or should I try the rears too if no change from the fronts?? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 26, 2014 Report Share Posted May 26, 2014 This thread explains the build issue> http://www.wheels-inmotion.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=165 ..... For now it's best just to move the fronts side-to-side just in case that by chance the rears have the same condition. In answer to your question a rear pneumatic drift shouldn't be possible since it has no direct influence on the steering but it can make the car drift one direction under acceleration and the other direction off throttle. As said moving the front wheels side-to-side should cost £0 and since your geometry report is fine then it's the next logical step. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedi Posted May 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2014 Swaped front wheels side to side. With the steering wheel in the straight ahead position, the car tended to drift, NOT pull to the right, ie the steering wheel did not dip to the right, but the car tented to move that way without moving the steering wheel.............. If i let go of the steering wheel it still wanted to go to the left but not as much as before........ Wheels in there origional positions With the steering wheel in the straight ahead position, the car will drive straight, but I am applying a counter force in order to stop the steering wheel turning left.........Last time I had to apply this type or counter force to a vehicle, It worn the inside edges of the front tyres. Also noticed and it might be just me thinking the worst .........but I get the slightest sensation that the car is crabbing....ie the near side rear is more nearer the kerb than the front........ Just out of interest Tony, if for what ever reason, the rear toe of the car could not be adjusted, ie....for example the rear tie bars had siezed soild that even heat would not budge them, what other options would there be for setting this car up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 The fact the symptoms have changed then we are working in the right direction ( excuse the pun ) As for the rear toe adjusters...... Well they are made of steel so unless the car has been parked in the sea for a few years then heat would do the deed. Point to note is the rear adjusters don't have a cast track rod end which you cannot heat because it would burn the carbon out the the end and weaken it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedi Posted May 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 Hmmmmm ill put it down to the tyre's then. Are the old geo settings worn into the tyres, if that makes sense.? I will see how it goes Thanks Tony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 Yes the tyres will wear to the axle they are on, this is why Tony doesn't recommend moving wheels front to rear or vise versa, it can upset the handling. I had a superb example of that when I put the summer wheels back on the missus Civic. The ones that were on the rear were near the limit so I moved them to the front cos I was replacing them. The car handled fine when they were on the rear but on the front it made it pull badly and the steering was alot heavier. Once the new tyres were on the handling went back to normal and the pull went away. It's amazing how much difference tyres can actually make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedi Posted May 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 Thanks Rich.....im always a bit suspicious when garages start blaming tyres for faults they cant fix, from past experiences.... Maybe this time it is the tyres? I would have thought a 4x4 would be more tollerant to variations in tyres, road surfaces etc...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 28, 2014 Report Share Posted May 28, 2014 The entire car funnels down to the tyres so they have the final say... Build issues as explained in the link are common, the next reason is the pattern of uneven wear influencing a pneumatic deflection and then the geometry as the parent reason for the wear. Word of warning if you do decide to replace some of the tyres, you cannot and must not have more than 3mm of tread difference over the axle or front-to-rear, meaning if you change the fronts lets say for new 8mm depth tyres and the rear tyres are at 4mm depth then you can damage the transfer box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedi Posted June 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 3, 2014 Thanks Tony....Im quite aware of all the Freelanders pitfalls. ...Im currently running without the prop, so transfer box sould be safe for now I supose I wont really know now until I have a new set of tyres on the front.....Might try the rears on the front some time and report back.... Thanks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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