grahamn Posted August 19, 2010 Report Share Posted August 19, 2010 Hi, Looking to change the front tyres on my 2008 BMW e92 2.5d coupe as the tread is about 3mm. I'm planning on staying with RFTs, but was wondering what the best replacement tyre would be. The original fit was Continental SSR SC2 and I have these on the rear too. Wheels are original 225/45 17". Grateful for any pointers as to what tyres would be best for this vehicle. The closest centre to me, seems to be Gloucester at the moment (40 ish miles away); any others opening up west/south west of Bristol? Many thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted August 19, 2010 Report Share Posted August 19, 2010 I've read on the Z4 forums that many recommend the Michelin PS2s, not sure if the same applies for the 3 series too. Also read that Michelins and Bridgestones can be puncture repaired once so that could be a factor too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted August 20, 2010 Report Share Posted August 20, 2010 Tyre recommendation is a really hard call because we all have different preference's. Is there a particular fault with the Continental you don't like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamn Posted August 20, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2010 Tyre recommendation is a really hard call because we all have different preference's. Is there a particular fault with the Continental you don't like? I suppose if I could get a less firm ride or less tramlining. Those are the key issues. I'm told thePirelli P0 is a later gen rft and better as a result??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hms Posted August 20, 2010 Report Share Posted August 20, 2010 Knowing the issues with BMW's, wheels and RFT is there not an option to go for proper tyres. (For proper read normal!) h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagitar Posted August 20, 2010 Report Share Posted August 20, 2010 Knowing the issues with BMW's, wheels and RFT is there not an option to go for proper tyres. (For proper read normal!)h Exactly the question that I asked my daughter when she spent around £1K recently on four new RFTs for her BMW. And the answer, there is nowhere in the car to keep a spare tyre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parthiban Posted August 21, 2010 Report Share Posted August 21, 2010 Exactly the question that I asked my daughter when she spent around £1K recently on four new RFTs for her BMW. And the answer, there is nowhere in the car to keep a spare tyre. Yep I'd never feel comfortable without having a spare - although ironically with everything everyone says about RFTs you won't be comfortable with them either Seriously though with regard to the Z4 many recommend that all of it's problems (ride and handling related) were vastly improved by fitting PS2s........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted August 21, 2010 Report Share Posted August 21, 2010 All RFT's give a harsh ride, the advice Pirelli are better is just an opinion. The harsh ride is the nature of the beast although the tramlining can be reduced ... Here are the problems.. 1: The tyre wall profile being very small 2: The armoured walls inability to deflect laterally 3: The migration of the front Toe angle during the suspensions articulation 4: The road condition All reads a bit desperate... But it's not. To save my fingers typing it all again here is a link in the webby> http://www.wheels-inmotion.co.uk/tram-lining-tyre-faults.php And here is a link to the official BMW Q&A regarding runflats> http://www.wheels-inmotion.co.uk/bmw-run-flat-problems.php scroll to the bottom of the page for the paper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamn Posted August 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2010 Thanks guys. Just to clarify a couple of things ... the suspension on my late 2008 is one where BMW have softened the suspension to accommodate the RFT, so going for regular/non RFT tyres may be too soft. As for the cost, I've got quotes from £115-£135 all included, so would struggle to spend £1000. True, there is no spare/space for one to be carried around, but also no need to change the wheel in the pouring rain, on the hard shoulder of a motorway, as I've done twice already in recent years...not pleasant, I assure you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamn Posted August 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2010 All RFT's give a harsh ride, the advice Pirelli are better is just an opinion. The harsh ride is the nature of the beast although the tramlining can be reduced ... Here are the problems.. 1: The tyre wall profile being very small 2: The armoured walls inability to deflect laterally 3: The migration of the front Toe angle during the suspensions articulation 4: The road condition All reads a bit desperate... But it's not. To save my fingers typing it all again here is a link in the webby> http://www.wheels-inmotion.co.uk/tram-lining-tyre-faults.php And here is a link to the official BMW Q&A regarding runflats> http://www.wheels-inmotion.co.uk/bmw-run-flat-problems.php scroll to the bottom of the page for the paper. Thanks Tony. In the piece you linked to that describes the RFT issues and what can done in terms of the toe setting being found (to minimse the tramlining issue), does this mean you guys know what the optimum toe is for any given BMW make/model/wheel etc, or is it a case of finding it each time for each vehicle? If you have found known toe angles that work, I assume this data is made available to the fitting centres around the country, rather than them using generic BMW/Hunter data? If that's the case, I'm very interested, but wonder if any fitting centre is opening nearer to me than at present....i.e nearer to SW Bristol/WSM direction ? I should also add that tramlining was not an issue when I firt had the car (from new) - until I had the steering geo. corrected/adjusted (at Gloucester as it happens) following pot hole and kerb issues last winter! Whilst it tracks true now on a good road surface, the sensitivity to tramlining is now present. Thanks in anticipation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted August 21, 2010 Report Share Posted August 21, 2010 We are led to believe the suspension is "downgraded" for the RFT but this is not the real picture. The suspension modification is more to do with unsprung weight thanks to the fact the RFT tyre is so heavy, BMW use a very light weight composite alloy wheel for this very reason and this is also why the wheels crack. Some time back i was asked to fit non RFT tyres to a BMW but "like you" i was worried about the pneumatic/ suspension relationship so i managed to have an "unofficial" conversation with one of the UK's BMW area super tech's, basically problem solvers for the network. Anyway as our friendship grew he confessed most BMW dealerships have fitted non RFT's The reason for this was not cost it was tyre availability. The RFT supply chain is somewhat slow to say the least. Given this confession we have fitted many non RFT tyres and not had a problem. Reading topics in the BMW forums owners have been delighted with the transformation. But be warned..... Although the ride will feel better and the tramlining disappears the cornering will feel more "fluid" initially and the steering reply a little lazy by comparison to the RFT, after a short time you the driver will adjust. As for a spare.... Who cares, you still have the pressure monitors so you'll know if a tyres going down plus like many new cars on the market that don't come with a spare, get a tin of tyre repair ( get you home ) spray. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamn Posted August 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2010 We are led to believe the suspension is "downgraded" for the RFT but this is not the real picture. The suspension modification is more to do with unsprung weight thanks to the fact the RFT tyre is so heavy, BMW use a very light weight composite alloy wheel for this very reason and this is also why the wheels crack. Some time back i was asked to fit non RFT tyres to a BMW but "like you" i was worried about the pneumatic/ suspension relationship so i managed to have an "unofficial" conversation with one of the UK's BMW area super tech's, basically problem solvers for the network. Anyway as our friendship grew he confessed most BMW dealerships have fitted non RFT's The reason for this was not cost it was tyre availability. The RFT supply chain is somewhat slow to say the least. Given this confession we have fitted many non RFT tyres and not had a problem. Reading topics in the BMW forums owners have been delighted with the transformation. But be warned..... Although the ride will feel better and the tramlining disappears the cornering will feel more "fluid" initially and the steering reply a little lazy by comparison to the RFT, after a short time you the driver will adjust. As for a spare.... Who cares, you still have the pressure monitors so you'll know if a tyres going down plus like many new cars on the market that don't come with a spare, get a tin of tyre repair ( get you home ) spray. All good points Tony. Can I change to non-RFT on one axle (front) in this case, or would it be really odd handling....in which case I need to change all four? And from another forum ...... "I know the RFT vs non-RFT debate has been done to death on many threads, but I got an interesting take from a friend the other day who is a chassis electronics engineer for a car company. He said that whilst it's true that mechanical components of the vehicle aren't altered according to what tyre is fitted on the production line, they do programme the ECU's with different configuration files depening on the tyre that's fitted. The config files are programmed after testing the protype vehicles with all the tyre-types that would be offered to the customer, and adjust primarily the characteristics of the various ABS and DSC systems according to tyre behaviour. The correct config programme is uploaded to the vehicle ECU once the vehicle has been specified with a tyre and it's options. " Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted August 21, 2010 Report Share Posted August 21, 2010 If you convert you need to do so as a set, you cannot ride a mix of RFT and non-RFT without killing yourself. Your friends comments on the ECU is utter bollox. The TC and ASC are "adaptive", they react to the conditions, brake possition, steering possition and yaw, they don't have a bloody clue what make of tyre your on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamn Posted August 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2010 Thanks Tony, all noted. Erm not a friend's comment btw - just someone posting on a thread on the www about the topic. Cheers. G. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted August 21, 2010 Report Share Posted August 21, 2010 Thanks Tony, all noted. Erm not a friend's comment btw - just someone posting on a thread on the www about the topic. Cheers. G. Noted, nevertheless they were wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamn Posted August 23, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2010 Thanks Tony, I'm sure you are right. Well I took the car down the local tyre fitting place today, and lo and behold they manage to damage both alloys in the process....complete bunch of tw*** ....then the fitter denies all knowledge. No wonder the tyre fitting industry has a wide-boy reputation....for 260 notes we will screw your alloys for you...I must change my career for a profession where quality doesn't count. Congrats to HiQ...stunning work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted August 24, 2010 Report Share Posted August 24, 2010 FFS why don't these places have the right equipment if they claim to be able to fit the tyres!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamn Posted August 24, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2010 FFS why don't these places have the right equipment if they claim to be able to fit the tyres!!!!! Very true Tony, now got to find a good refurbisher I need a WIM / Chris Mullins type outfit near to me! Needless to say the HiQ outfit in BS20 won't be getting any more business from as many people as I can possibly warn. One tyre place in the whole town, and they're cr**. Someone could clean up here by offering a good honest service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamn Posted August 25, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2010 Also just discovered they set the pressures were set to 2.7 BAR rather than the correct 2.1 BAR....thought the handling was odd.... Total numpties at HiQ Portishead.. DO NOT use them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted August 25, 2010 Report Share Posted August 25, 2010 I take it you are going to proper complain about this!!...... Also if you go back have the manager undo the wheel nuts with a normal length wheel brace, i bet everyone is locked solid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamn Posted August 25, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2010 Yep, complained in person within30 mins of job being done, to no avail. Promised phonecalls never come etc etc. When I call, "the boss" is not in.... Have now put transaction in dispute with credit card co. who have been very helpful...that should focus a few minds... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted August 25, 2010 Report Share Posted August 25, 2010 Are they part of any federation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamn Posted August 25, 2010 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2010 Not that I can see Tony, unless being a HiQ Franchisee counts! "Knights Tyres" T/A Hi-Q Tyre Services. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted August 25, 2010 Report Share Posted August 25, 2010 Normally like us this industry agrees a relationship with a motor industry arbitrator that in the event of a dispute directs the complaint. We are arbitrators for Vauxhall and Peugeot UK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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