AndyFR32 Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Hi Guys, I have had an issue on my car in regards to camber and toe settings and is now driving me crazy, i need my mind putting at ease to see if my car is right and if not how to put right! In October i had a front nearside wheel bearing replaced and since i had problems with camber and toe issues, basically the steering wheel was out of line when the car was going in a straight line. I have recently had my car on a Hunter 4 wheel alignment, i still dont think that the car is correct after this alignment. The issue i have is that the car still wont go in a straight line when i release the steering wheel it pulls to the left and is certainly most noticeable on a road with a heavy camber to the left. What i cant understand is that when i hold the steering wheel it stays perfectly straight and there isnt much need of input to correct any "pulling". I have also tried driving on the wrong side of the road (when its quiet of course! lol) and have noticed a slight pull to the right which may suggest to me that it could be correct but for some reason i dont think the car is set up correctly. Now i did notice that the inner tyre shoulders have worn but would this at all be the reason for the pull? Before the bearing was replaced the car seemed fine! I have the read out after alignment as follows. Camber Front left -1.10 Front right -0.48 Rear right -1.39 Rear left -2.05 Toe Front left 0.01 Front right 0.00 Rear left 0.02 Rear right 0.07 Caster Front left 7.04 Front right 7.35 You will notice on the above figures that Camber is too negative on the nearside and i was also told that if rear camber is out this wouldnt make much of a difference to how the car handles and drives but i beg to differ! I heard about this forum through the R32 Owners Club, id appreciate and any feedback as to why i have this problem! Thanks in advance. Andy. P.S It eont let me upload the readout i have so i hope the above figures make sence! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 22, 2012 Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 Hello Andy Sometimes it's my job to say what somethings not and the geometry on your car is not the problem. The next line of attack would be the tyres since they have final contact with the road. I suggest you move the fronts side-to-side and test drive the car noting any change in the handling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 Hi Tony Thanks for getting back to me, i was planning on changing the tyres asap! They dont look very good at all. I am aware that the R32's have a harsh negative camber which causes the tyres to ware like this. Is there anyway i could email you an image of the print out i have as you may be able to tell me more. I have also noticed my suspension top mounts have worn, which again is a common issue on the R32! Would this cause any of the issues? Thanks in advance Andy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 22, 2012 Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 If the top mounts are worn then the steering tends to bolt to the left and right unpredictably rather than a consistant pull in one direction..... You can email the report to tony@wheels-inmotion.co.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 Yes i have noticed this on uneven roads when letting go of the steering wheel at slow speeds! I have just emailed you :-) Thanks for you help. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 22, 2012 Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 Got the pictures...... The front cambers are deep and the NSF is near to the max tolerance of -1 degree 15'. Since the NSF is deep and the NSF castor is low then it's a fair bet the wheel has hit a pothole or similar. The problem with the camber adjuster is the sub frame needs to be moved to optimize both cambers, what you can't do is move one camber, one direction. Nevertheless it's not the reason the car is pulling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 Thanks for your help Tony, would say that that the current settings are bad or ok? The pulling could be down to the tyres then at a guess? In regards to subframe adjustment would a wheel alignment specialist be able to correct this? I have the car booked in next Thursday at a place near me! Where are you based by the way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 22, 2012 Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 It was probably the NSF camber position that took the bearing out. In truth it's not that bad but if the sub frame is moved then all it will do is transport the problem to the other side. Ideally you need aftermarket camber adjusters, if there are any made?...... I'm based in Chesham, Bucks by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 Thanks for that Tony, your help is much appreciated. I noticed it more when i had more air in the tyres but iv dropped them down to around 30 psi and it does feel a bit better so im thinking it could be more to do with the tyres and the reason for the pull! Its just odd how the steering wheel sags down to the left when i let go of the wheel, its more noticeable on roads with a harsh camber. When i have hold of the wheel it mainly stays bang on in the center. Could you explain this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 22, 2012 Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 This thread might help> http://www.wheels-inmotion.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=165 The same condition can arise when the tread has worn uneven. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 Very interesting, like people have mentioned i bet alot of tyre fitters dont even realise this! Its an art form to get this all right! Might have to take a trip down to see you guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 22, 2012 Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 Trust me they don't....... My customers tend to travel a long way to us, so if it's a pulling problem i always ask if it started after tyres were fitted or moved, often this is the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 I live on the wirral, it might be worth a trip to see you as i want the car right! I will try tyres first and process of elimination and will explain to them when they put the tyres how to do it correctly! Thanks again Tony i appreciate your help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 22, 2012 Report Share Posted December 22, 2012 Your welcome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2012 Hi Tony, i have noticed that the car is behaving a little better now that the pressures are lower. I think you are correct in saying it could be the tyre and the way it has worn on the old settings thus pulling the car over. I will get new tyres and try that and will keep you updated. if not i may make a trip down to see you! Kind regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Hi Tony, I have been to get my car checked today, i have sent you an email with this information on. The alignment figures have changed since i last had it done earlier this month. Unless some pixies in the night have come and adjusted it i dont understand how this would be? ( I have been very carefull and missed pot holes) They couldnt adjust any of the settings as they have said something is "bent"! The guys where very helpfull and sounded like they knew what they where on about but still i dont get why the figures have changed and they also said not to change the tyres untill everything was corrected! Can you help please? Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 I have to assume their ramp is level? Slight changes in the figures is normal simply due to the fuel level. If their ramp is level then all they need to do is mover the front sub frame, if you look at the numbers the NSF camber is to deep and the OSF is to vertical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Hi Tony, I asked them if they could do this and they said it wouldnt correct the problem! it just annoys me as now im thinking there is something major wrong with the car, would you say that the tyres could make a difference and make the settings off as they may have worn to the old settings thus throwing it all out? I wish you was around the corner.lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Moving the sub frame would cure the problem, they are talking rubbish..... The tyres cannot influence the data, in fact i don't even need the wheel on the car, let alone the tyre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Tony i appreciate your help, i will get new tyres in that instance and see if this corrects the pulling! I dont understabd why people fob you off as this could cost someone with little understanding a whole lot of cash. Very glad i was pointed in your direction! Is it a long job to move the sub frame? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Takes around half an hour.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 thanks for letting me know again Tony, cars going in tomorrow for new tyres as well as a 3rd check at a VAG specialist to determine any damage or "Bent" components. They said they can do the subframe adjustment if this is required! have you worked on many R32's or Mk1 Audi TT's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 28, 2012 Report Share Posted December 28, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyFR32 Posted December 28, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2012 Hi Tony, To give you an update, 2 new tyres cured the "pulling" so must of been tyre pull. Got the car on the ramps at QR Sport in Chester (not far From Oulton Park) they specialise in VAG Group and track day cars. Nothings bent and they made a few adjustments and all corners of the car are in "Green" now after their Hunter alignment! It must be that the previous place i went to must not of had their ramp set up or the machine not calibrated correctly! Its quiet scary really and annoys me a little but im glad my car seems to be ok again, i know without your help it wouldnt of been possible! Thanks again Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted December 29, 2012 Report Share Posted December 29, 2012 Thanks for the thanks ....... By deduction i knew it was those tyres because the geometric numbers didn't match the complaint. I have to agree it is scary for the public out there, not just in the equipment and calibration state but also the knowledge of those being paid to understand the information generated. Welcome back to your car Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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