MINI JCW Alignment

[MLAM]

Hi all

I got my wives R56 JCW aligned today at a German Specialist who also have a Hunter 4 Wheel Alignment System (They got it in recently)

I got 4x New Michelin Pilot Sport 4 fitted Yesterday at Costco and did approx 20 miles on the old alignment settings as this place is near my home.

I turned up to the place and handed my key over while they did their business, the guy I spoke to on the phone yesterday and the reception lady today both said the car gets weighted up as per BMW spec however I cannot confirm if they did as I couldn't see the car.

Anyway after about 30 mins she shows me the measurements and shows the rear toe and camber being out which in turn will need to do the front so cost will be full 4 wheel alignment and she said everything will be nice and central.

A good hour later the car I see gets taken out and goes for a road test then a quick wash, once it gets back she shows me the after results and I see the cambers are not central but are "Within spec", I queried it and she said it isn't possible to get the camber all even.

I said I'll see how I get on and paid up and left, but just wanted to get Tony's or any other seasoned experts view on this?
My concern is the rear left camber is reasonably deeper than the right now AFTER adjustment.

I did take it for a short drive afterwards and it seems to drive ok, maybe down to the road (poor surface Motorway) I did get the feeling it pulled to the right a little.

Below are two pictures of before and after:

Any information appreciated

[Tony]

Hello

I don't think it's been weighted because both the rear cambers are too upright which is a really odd position to be.  Is it on the run-flat tyres? Because if it is you're going to have problems.

Also i don't like the print format because it doesn't show the min/ max values. I use the Hunter and I've never seen that type of print-out or have i seen an option to have that format?

[MLAM]

2 hours ago, Tony said:

Hello

I don't think it's been weighted because both the rear cambers are too upright which is a really odd position to be.  Is it on the run-flat tyres? Because if it is you're going to have problems.

Also i don't like the print format because it doesn't show the min/ max values. I use the Hunter and I've never seen that type of print-out or have i seen an option to have that format?

Hi Tony, 

Thanks for your reply, when you say it is too upright do you mean the before or after adjustments?
The car DID have run flats but I've just changed them to 4x New Michelin PS4 Non Run Flats.
What problems would I have?

I did think that too but I did see the system and it looked like a Hunter System with its high mounted lasers and the wheel mounts.

The Spec for a JCW I found to be this:

Front camber -0 degrees 30 minutes
Rear camber -1 degree 45 minutes
Toe in front +0 degrees 12 minutes
Toe in rear +0 degrees 24 minutes

So to me it is the rear camber to be a bit off.

What could I say to them for them to re do it as they seem quite sure it is done to within spec?

Thanks for the help so far

[Tony]

It's just poor workmanship to be honest. The rear camber adjuster is on a eccentric cam so it's not hard to be exact. Problem is they will argue this to the max saying it's "in the green" which is the general attitude.

I would still ask them to tidy it up and be sure they have weighted the car if needed. The reason i say if needed is the data asks for a certain body height but the actual height depends on the coils condition. Low mileage the body will be high, high mileage the body will be low. So there's no two cars that need the same weight, if any?

The OEM rear camber settings will be fine on the none run-flat tyres, so you're safe there.

[Rich]

Does it matter they've not measured the caster?

[MLAM]

2 hours ago, Tony said:

It's just poor workmanship to be honest. The rear camber adjuster is on a eccentric cam so it's not hard to be exact. Problem is they will argue this to the max saying it's "in the green" which is the general attitude.

I would still ask them to tidy it up and be sure they have weighted the car if needed. The reason i say if needed is the data asks for a certain body height but the actual height depends on the coils condition. Low mileage the body will be high, high mileage the body will be low. So there's no two cars that need the same weight, if any?

The OEM rear camber settings will be fine on the none run-flat tyres, so you're safe there.

That's most disappointing considering how long they spent on my car.

I guess I could say the car drifts to the right and I feel it's coming from the rear which should give them no excuse?

That's a very good point as I forgot that coils sag, this example is low miles at 23k.

Would having more negative camber on the front help with steering lightness?

As Rich mentioned does it matter about the Caster?

[Tony]

Camber has a conical force meaning it wants to roll into the cars centre. At the moment you have more force on the NSF pushing to the right which could explain the pull. The castor positions are fine and reasonably high for such a light car. The reason they are in gray shade is because of the way BMW measure it in the factory. Out of the factory we can't measure it the same way so Hunter has removed the target datum.